One must maintain possession of grace through contact.
by tdiddy07 (2024-04-16 14:48:29)

In reply to: I struggle with this as a Protestant.  posted by bizdomer09


Yes, one may be saved by receiving grace in duress. But Catholics insist on evidence that you've made it through the duress while continuing to maintain possession of your grace before declaration that you, in fact, possessed it in the first instance.


Someone super smart once said
by HTownND  (2024-04-16 15:14:39)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

"What does it profit, my brethren, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can faith save him? If a brother or sister is naked and destitute of daily food, and one of you says to them, “Depart in peace, be warmed and filled,” but you do not give them the things which are needed for the body, what does it profit? Thus also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead"


To paraphrase Bishop Fulton Sheen, "I imagine when we seek
by Father Nieuwland  (2024-04-16 16:57:47)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

entry at those pearly gates, Our Lord will be there and say to us, "Show me your hands. Do they have scars from giving? Show me your feet. Are they wounded from service? Show me your heart. Have you left a place for Divine Love?"


Exactly ...
by CJC  (2024-04-16 15:51:15)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

How much evidence? How many works? Who decides?

I try hard never to judge the heart (eternal fate) of another; it's way above my pay grade.

I will say that if I observed a life seemingly completely devoid of conduct consistent with a faith in (submission to) Jesus, I'd have a difficult time concluding that person had eternal life (That same super smart guy said, "If you love me, you will obey my commands.")

But even in that scenario, I'll leave it to God to sort out, kind of like the thief on the cross.

I might humbly propose that many of us and many churches (of all Christian denominations) spend far too much time trying to decide who is in and who is out.

It might be better for all concerned -- churches and individuals alike -- if we spent more time examining (and seeking to grow in) our own love for Jesus and graciously encouraging others to an ever-increasing pursuit of that love (and obedience - per John 14:15).


Agreed
by HTownND  (2024-04-17 09:34:45)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

I have my own plank in my ocular cavity to worry about

Judge not lest you be judged and all that.




I've taken to this quote as my main driver, it's often mischaracterized to Francis, but goes like this.


"Preach the gospel at all times, and when necessary, use words"


Brow beating people on the rules and judging them isn't going to get anyone where they need to go