In reply to: (B) is better posted by fontoknow
12 eight team conferences equals 96 schools...
An 8 team conference could look something like:
Notre Dame + Purdue + IU + Ball State + Michigan + Michigan State + Western Michigan + Central Michigan + Eastern Michigan (That's actually nine teams)..
Geographically, I suppose it could be grouped with...
Notre Dame + Purdue + IU + Ball State + Northwestern + Illinois + Northern Illinois (That's seven).
If it was 8 conferences of 8, then we would essentially only be dealing with P5 type opponents and we could see something like:
Notre Dame + Purdue + IU + Northwestern + Illinois + Michigan + Michigan State (again that's 7 teams...)
Assuming we played one of those as our core group and then played USC, Stanford, Navy, _______, _______ would we be content with that?
All of these types of scenarios are like joining the B10-light...
64 is too few, and leaves us stranded, and anything much over 100 is too diluted.
I'm also assuming that our conference would be less geographic than some others, and that the old guard conferences would retain most of their cores (particularly the Big Ten and the SEC) while shedding their new arrivals.
I can't see them dropping to 8 per conference... too many schools would be squeezed out.... 10 would be more natural... Teams back in w/ 10 per
B10: Ohio State, Michigan State, Michigan, Wisconsin, Minnesota, Illinois, Purdue & IU
Out: Maryland, Rutgers, Penn State, Nebraska, Iowa, and Northwestern
B12: Baylor, TCU, Kansas State, Oklahoma, Texas, Oklahoma State, Texas Tech, and Kansas
Out: West Virginia and Iowa State (or TCU if they push out the "new guy")
Pac: Oregon, Oregon State, Washington, Washington State, Stanford, UCLA, Cal, USC
Out: Arizona, Arizona State, Utah, Colorado
SEC: Georgia, Florida, South Carolina, Ole Miss, Miss St, Alabama, Auburn, LSU
Out: Missouri, Kentucky, Vandy, Texas A&M, Arkansas, Tennessee
ACC:Florida State, Clemson, North Carolina, NC State, Wake, Duke, GT, Virgina
Out: Louisville, BC, Syracuse, Pitt, Miami, VT
And now if Notre Dame in this fantasy world can pick the next 7-9 schools to join it...
ND: Notre Dame, Nebraska, Iowa, Vandy, Louisville, BC, Syracuse, Pitt, Kentucky, and say Maryland?
I think this would be just as bad....
I think to really make it work (for ND) you would have to blow up and rape the other "conferences" to steal USC/UCLA/Cal/Stanford (presumably a group) away from Oregon/Oregon State/Washington/Washington State (and Arizona/Arizona State)... and then maybe Texas/Oklahoma/Oklahoma State away from the rest of the Big12 to give you...
Notre Dame + USC/UCLA/Cal/Stanford + Texas/Oklahoma/Oklahoma State
And that leaves them with:
B12: Baylor, TCU, Kansas State, Texas Tech, Kansas, West Virginia and Iowa State and ________________ (maybe pulling back in Nebraska or TA&M)
Pac: Oregon, Oregon State, Washington, Washington State, Arizona, Arizona State, Utah, Colorado
An alternate idea would basically be to create a lottery system... and just randomly assign 8-10 teams to a conference, and then re-assign them every other year (to allow for home and homes)... and allow each team to have 3-5 other games that it can separately negotiate (i.e. Notre Dame would be able to keep Stanford, USC, Navy + ____ and _____)
All this assumes that conference affiliation is inevitable. It is in no way my preference (real independence is my preference).
That said, try these potential alignments:
2. Mountain West:
U of A
3. Big Eight (reconstituted):
Nebraska (welcome home)
4. Texas Conference:
Texas A&M (Welcome back, boys)
5. Big Ten (still can't count, so they won't change their name):
6. Western Athletic Conference:
San Jose State
San Diego State
7. Big East (reconstituted):
8. Notre Dame Conference* (name TBD):
9. Southeastern Conference
10. Mid-American Conference
11. Atlantic Coast Conference
12. Piedmont Conference
The SEC is still a little heavy, but it's the core of the conference, so oh well. The WAC is relying on Boise State as its headliner, and the MAC doesn't have one, but these conferences seem to make sense to me, and at least for us give us the following:
some geographic reach
some good in-conference competition
another elite name in conference
some cultural affinity (i.e., some that take school seriously)
a long-standing schedule partner
only 1 or 2 potential conference body bag games
Obviously you took a lot of time to do this. Just a few thoughts:
1. Your Texas conference is the old SWC, at least after Arkansas left.
2. You have Houston listed twice, once in the SWC and once in our conference. I think they're a better fit in the SWC.
3. Not sure about Miami (Ohio) in the Big East conference. Buffalo makes more sense geographically. And their program is at least as good right now as Miami's, even though they lack the history.
4. Omitting Northern Illinois while keeping the MAC programs you kept is a mistake imho.
5. I would swap Missouri and Minnesota.
But you're right, this just isn't gonna happen no matter what. The power conferences have too much power to disband or voluntarily drop programs. Our best bet would be to form a new conference.
Scratch Houston from No. 8, move Maryland from the Piedmont Conference to ours, drop Ohio U from the MAC to the Piedmont Conference, and add NIU back to the MAC.
I could certainly live with swapping Missouri and Minnesota. That would come close to reconstituting the old Big Eight and Minnesota would probably be a better fit for us.
Buffalo would be relegated to FCS and rightly so. Miami (OH) got a promotion to the BIG EAST because their history required keeping them, but hardc choices had to be made in cutting all of the traditionally 10-team conferences (Big Ten, SEC, and MAC in particular) down to 8 teams.
If conference affiliation were an absolute requirement to compete for championships then I could tolerate something like this. It would have the added benefit of diluting the talent pool across more conferences while simultaneously protecting the talent pool for top level football as a whole, and diluting ESPN's influence in the sport. I assume that many power conferences would mean that CBS, Fox, and NBC would each be willing to pay to play.
1. Swap Missouri for Minnesota, as stated previously.
2. I would put NIU in the MAC and remove one of the bottom feeders you left in, say Kent State.
3. I would swap Cincinnati for Miami (Ohio). Geographically, that's a wash, and Cincinnati at least has some history with the Big East.
4. For the final member of our conference, in lieu of Houston (already included), I would include UCF. Imho, that program has the greatest upside of any of those you left out. Plus, it means a guaranteed road trip to Florida every year.