IU was an absolute mess before his arrival, and in 4 years he had them in the Sweet 16, and a 1 seed in year 5.
Williams is obviously a good coach, but I've already noted that he'd be 5-5 in the tourney as well if not for one of the most fortunate sequences I've ever seen in the tourney.
I think both are clearly very good coaches.
This was Crean's 5th season at Indiana. Sweet 16 last year was his 4th season. He isn't a very good coach sans recruiting. He can recruit incredibly well. He's petty and hopefully will be in a hurry to get to the NBA.
He got lucky that Zeller wanted to stay close to his Washington home. That's all. That's it.
Williams runs circles around him.
hope some dumb NBA owner grabs him. I was holding off on his coaching acumen until this season was over as I wanted to see how he'd do with a full roster of talent.
He is not a good in-game coach, he might be able to devise a game plan but he can't execute it. He's perfect for the NBA.
Where would Williams be this year without Vander Blue? Sitting at home with a matching 5-5 tourney record.
If you're done with Crean, I'll happily take him at ND.
on less than 40% shooting last year? Blue's tournament performance has not been for a lack of coaching. This is not the same player as last year or even earlier this season.
I spent four years watching talent flounder under Crean at Marquette. Crean can recruit, I'll give him that, but Williams runs circles around Crean on the Court. The comparison isn't even close, IMO.
The tongue tripping and hyperbole over MU playing IU (or MU playing CREAN, actually) would have been great.
...that MU needed in the last 45 seconds to beat Davidson. That's my point.
Everyone is enamored with Williams' 8-4 tourney record. He's very fortunatel that it isn't the same 5-5 that Crean complied at Marquette.
4 of those wins. Just to point out the obvious, Tom Crean had one with in the tournament without Wade. Atrocious.
That being said, I'm not sure how you can discount three straight trips to the Sweet Sixteen. Even if MU loses to Davidson as you are so sure the basketball gods must have intended, reaching the Sweet Sixteen twice in three years is still one more than Crean ever did at MU.
I should also note, in Crean's nine years at MU, he made the tournament five times.
Buzz Williams has not missed the tournament since he was hired in 2008.
And I don't really like either one. Williams may very well be a better coach.
Calling Crean mediocre is a stretch, IMO.
I will be honest, I knew who he was long ago. I was done with him during the Dominic James era at Marquette. He's a great recruiter and brings in very good quality kids. For that, he should be commended.
Some of the behind the scenes stuff rubs me way the wrong way. I wouldn't want Crean at ND, that would piss me off too.
There is a lot of distance between "not as good as Izzo" and "mediocre".
Mediocre coaches don't go to Final Fours or bring back programs from the dead.
I find both Cream and Williams annoying to watch, but much of that is probably because I saw them against ND, and am projecting that.
Regardless,we'll just have to agree to disagree that Crean is mediocre, and that Williams' tourney record is not extremely fortunate.
fortunate. He can thank Clay Tucker for 2 extra wins.
Besides, big difference between one missed contested layup... and 2 missed front ends and a TO in 3 possessions.
I don't think anyone has argued Brey as a good tourney coach since 2003.
What coach hasn't had squeaky bum time great escapes in their career?
Surely all the great ones haven't won every Tournament game in a blowout.
MU came back from a 7 point deficit in 45 seconds. Davidson missed 2 front ends of one on ones and turned the ball over on their 3 possessions in that stretch.
That's about as lucky as you can get. And without it, Williams is 5-5 in the tourney right now, same as Crean was.
luck, do you? Why only Buzz? And is this only basketball? What about Kelly's luck against Stanford or Pitt? Where does it end?
The only good coaches are those who win regular season games.
The coaches who win in the tournament do so because of luck; e.g., favorable seeding, opponent flame out.
Except Brey! When that kid from UW-Milwaukee missed the open go-ahead lay-up in the 1st Round of Brey's only Sweet 16 (which I witnessed in person), that wasn't luck. No, sir!
That was all coaching.
Buzz Williams won plenty of regular season games. He has had MU as a 3-seed the last 2 seasons.
As late as last Thursday, posters were calling MU a fraud who didn't deserve a 3 seed, and going unchallenged in that assertion. Now, Buzz Williams is the best thing since sliced bread.
If you're seriously contending that luck doesn't have anything to do with Williams' current record, I'd bet you didn't watch their first or second round games.
Doesn't mean he isn't a good coach. Just as IU's loss doesn't mean Crean isn't a good coach.
It was comparing Crean to Williams. Crean may have had some luck in his tourney wins, too, I don't know.
All I've been saying is that Williams is fortunate to be 8-4 and not 5-5. I don't really see how that is arguable.
but, in the end, after reading your thoughts up and down it just seems to be a case of you feeling Marquette is getting fortunate with their March wins.
Without that win, Buzz Williams' current 8-4 record (which is impressive) is 5-5 (which is not as impressive).
I honestly hope MU wins it all. I have a number of friends that went there. They're obnoxious when ND plays MU, but I'd still love to see them get a chance to enjoy winning it.