Elko on his defense
by SEE (2017-07-15 20:48:54)
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Understanding many don't like Driskell, take that into account as you read it. I don't think the interviewer has much to do with Elko's answers, but I understand the viewpoint.


There is no reason for optimism here.
by 84david  (2017-07-17 09:02:56)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

Kelly is lazy and self absorbed. He's proved that
for 7 years.

Elko might be a good coach and may even say
the right things. I'll be wary of the staff all year.
He still works for BK who sets the tone.


Kelly is doomed IMO, but it wouldn't surprise me at all if
by SEE  (2017-07-19 11:43:55)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

He made a run this year. Equal chance he collapses


What do you consider a run? 8 wins?
by 84david  (2017-07-21 11:19:12)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

I think that's his ceiling this year.


No, playoffs or a decent BCS
by SEE  (2017-07-21 11:27:10)     Delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

anything else is suck


I'll disagree slightly
by pmcdnd96  (2017-07-17 14:21:00)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

I agree on everything about Kelly, the tone, etc.

But here's where I'm very, very cautiously optimistic:
1.) Kelly has let his DC's run the defense, for better or for worse. Diaco ran one style and BVG ran another style.
2.) Elko may just talk a good game, but I like his focus on basics. The thing that has driven me the most nuts since Kelly's arrival has been our over-reliance on strategery. Even in a relatively simple defense (Diaco's) we seemed to think we needed an answer for every unique situation as opposed to having rules and keys for our defensive players. I will never forget the "kudos to Navy!" for running the veer...which wasn't really the veer, but I digress. We should be able to line up in a base defense and physically beat the crap out of Navy. Our focus on tactics has really hurt us
3.) The stuff about Tranquill - the "Rover" talk made me roll my eyes, but the idea that we will be putting players in the best positions for them to succeed is a good one and seems like a refreshing change from "putting players n the field to put other players in position."
4.) Rankings of Elko's scoring defenses:
Wake Forest: 60, 43, 23
Bowling Green: 100, 77, 10, 5 (year after he left: 108)
I don't know the personnel he had on either team, but that seems like pretty steady improvement from both teams

Does that make me suddenly think we'll be great? Not at all. But I do think there are legitimate reasons for us to be cautiously optimistic.


Who did Wake and BGSU play?
by HTownND  (2017-07-17 15:56:41)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

It's not like he was outdueling the top offensive minds in CFB.

2009 BGSU
Team Result Opponent O Rank
Boise State Broncos  Lost 49-14 1
Central Michigan Chippewas  Lost 24-10 13
Troy Trojans  Won 31-14 16
Idaho Vandals  Lost 43-42 20
Toledo Rockets  Won 38-24 38
at Missouri Tigers  Lost 27-20 49
Ohio Bobcats  Lost 44-37 78
at Buffalo Bulls  Won 30-29 82
at Marshall Thundering Herd Lost 17-10 95
Akron Zips  Won 36-20 105
at Kent State Golden Flashes  Won 36-35 106
at Ball State Cardinals  Won 31-17 108
at Miami (OH) RedHawks  Won 35-14 116


2010 BGSU
Team Result Opponent O Rank
at Tulsa Golden Hurricane Lost 33-20 6
at Troy Trojans  Lost 30-27 20
at Michigan Wolverines  Lost 65-21 25
Western Michigan Broncos  Lost 41-7 28
at Toledo Rockets  Lost 33-14 54
at Ohio Bobcats  Lost 49-25 55
at Temple Owls  Lost 28-27 79
at Central Michigan Chippewas  Won 17-14 82
Miami (OH) RedHawks  Lost 24-21 98
Kent State Golden Flashes  Lost 30-6 100
Marshall Thundering Herd Won 44-28 102
Buffalo Bulls  Lost 28-26 120


2011 BGSU
Team Result Opponent O Rank
Toledo Rockets  Lost 28-21 8
Northern Illinois Huskies  Lost 45-14 12
at West Virginia Mountaineers  Lost 55-10 13
at Western Michigan Broncos  Lost 45-21 18
Temple Owls  Won 13-10 40
Ohio Bobcats  Lost 29-28 41
Wyoming Cowboys  Lost 28-27 67
at Buffalo Bulls  Won 42-28 97
at Miami (OH) RedHawks  Won 37-23 104
at Idaho Vandals  Won 32-15 106
at Kent State Golden Flashes  Lost 27-15 114
Morgan State Bears Won 58-13 N/A

2012 BGSU
Team Result Opponent O Rank
San Jose State Spartans  Lost 29-20 29
Kent State Golden Flashes  Lost 31-24 35
at Ohio Bobcats  Won 26-14 43
at Toledo Rockets Lost 27-15 48
at Florida Gators Lost 27-14 78
at Akron Zips  Won 24-10 79
at Virginia Tech Hokies Lost 37-0 83
Miami (OH) RedHawks  Won 37-12 92
Buffalo Bulls  Won 21-7 100
Eastern Michigan Eagles  Won 24-3 101
Idaho Vandals Won 21-13 123
at UMass Minutemen  Won 24-0 124
Rhode Island Rams (HC) Won 48-8 N/A

2013 BGSU
Team Result Opponent O Rank
Northern Illinois Huskies  Won 47-27 10
at Indiana Hoosiers Lost 42-10 23
Toledo Rockets  Lost 28-25 38
at Buffalo Bulls  Won 24-7 48
Pittsburgh Panthers  Lost 30-27 67
at Mississippi State Bulldogs  Lost 21-20 76
Ohio Bobcats  Won 49-0 83
Tulsa Golden Hurricane Won 34-7 94
at Kent State Golden Flashes  Won 41-22 102
Akron Zips  Won 31-14 113
at Eastern Michigan Eagles  Won 58-7 114
at Miami (OH) RedHawks  Won 45-3 123
UMass Minutemen (HC) Won 28-7 125
Murray State Racers  Won 48-7 N/A

2014 WF
Team Result Opponent O Rank
at Florida State Seminoles  Lost 43-3 35
at Duke Blue Devils  Lost 41-21 42
at Louisville Cardinals  Lost 20-10 53
Clemson Tigers  Lost 34-20 54
at NC State Wolfpack Lost 42-13 57
at Utah State Aggies  Lost 36-24 82
Boston College Eagles  Lost 23-17 86
Army Black Knights  Won 24-21 93
Virginia Tech Hokies  Won 6-3 (2OT) 96
at ULM Warhawks  Lost 17-10 115
Syracuse Orange  Lost 30-7 121
Gardner-Webb Bulldogs  Won 23-7 N/A



2015 WF
Team Result Opponent O Rank
at North Carolina Tar Heels  Lost 50-14 9
at Clemson Tigers  Lost 33-13 16
Indiana Hoosiers (HC) Lost 31-24 25
at Notre Dame Fighting Irish  Lost 28-7 34
NC State Wolfpack Lost 35-17 42
Florida State Seminoles  Lost 24-16 47
Duke Blue Devils  Lost 27-21 48
Louisville Cardinals  Lost 20-19 65
at Syracuse Orange  Lost 30-17 77
at Army Black Knights  Won 17-14 109
at Boston College Eagles  Won 3-0 121
Elon Phoenix  Won 41-3 N/A



2016 WF
Team Result Opponent O Rank
at Louisville Cardinals  Lost 44-12 6
Clemson Tigers  Lost 35-13 14
at Florida State Seminoles  Lost 17-6 31
Temple Owls  Won 34-26 43
Army Black Knights (HC) Lost 21-13 59
at NC State Wolfpack Lost 33-16 77
at Indiana Hoosiers  Won 33-28 88
Syracuse Orange  Won 28-9 90
Tulane Green Wave Won 7-3 105
Virginia Cavaliers  Won 27-20 115
Boston College Eagles  Lost 17-14 118
at Duke Blue Devils  Won 24-14 110 (how the F we lost to this team, still boggles the F'ing Mind)
Delaware Blue Hens  Won 38-21 N/A


So let's be very clear here, yes he was working at a talent disadvantage, but it's not like he's gone up against better teams, consistently, and shut them down. Most of the highly ranked offenses on this list, aren't the A List O Coordinators and teams we know about. This is a limited resume. And those using the transitive property to assume that with better talent he'll be better under the bright lights, generally speaking, don't understand the game/sport. It's not played in a vacuum or on computer simulators. We have 8 years of results up there. Which games am I supposed to be in awe of, or thinking he went up against the best and did an amazing job? Where is the kick ass performance?

This also doesn't mean I think he sucks. I just think we may need to re-evaluate expectations, especially in year one (that 2014 stat line at WF is ugly). He's not a messiah or miracle worker. I don't think he's god awful, but I also fail to see what everyone else is seeing, that we pulled off some major coup in getting him to come to ND from WF. Time will tell, but he'll face a diet of much better offenses, coached by much better coaches while at ND than he's ever seen.


Mostly a fair point
by pmcdnd96  (2017-07-17 16:49:17)     Delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

Your overall point is fair. I do think you overestimate the level of coaches he will be seeing next year. Here are the 2016 rankings of scoring offense for each team we face next year:

Temple - 43
Georgia - 102
Boston College - 118
Michigan State - 104
Miami, OH - 114
UNC - 44
USC - 36
NC State - 75
Wake Forest - 118
Miami - 37
Navy - 20
Stanford - 82

I'm not in any group that looks at this hire as some kind of major coup. But he appears to be a much more reasonable hire than any coordinator Kelly has brought on thus far.


Yup, and no asst. coach had the stones to challenge a 2 pt.
by irishguard78  (2017-07-17 10:59:08)     Delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

idiotic conversion against Northwestern ....or all of our assistant coaches were themselves idiots for not understanding that a 2 pt. conversion never made sense.

Either way, it speaks of Kelly's inabilities in hiring, only allowing sycophants to be assistant coaches or in making stupid coaching decisions all by himself.

That whole 2 point conversion shit show became my jumping off point. Kelly is either a stupid coach, too arrogant to allow his assistants to challenge him or both. No matter, we won't go very far with that kind of person in charge.


Where's the fart noise button? *
by MD1997  (2017-07-16 11:20:15)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post


You can pick them up at the Crossroads giftshop...
by Brahms  (2017-07-16 17:11:59)     Delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

...sure, they're pricier than getting them online or via the grey market, but they're officially licensed ND gear, and all proceeds go to a good cause...


When you click on BGI *
by 2ndstreeter  (2017-07-16 13:46:23)     Delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post


pretty much agree with everything he said
by jt  (2017-07-16 00:23:54)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

in fact, it has been said often on this board--

- not fundamentally sound in the past
- poor tackling
- focus on basics now (implying a lack of it in the past)
- trying to win (in the past) in the meeting room instead of on the field


Odd that it would take such a complete breakdown for people to come around. Of course, the same folks defending BVG in the past are now burying him and praising the new guy so I will take some time before holding up a "mission accomplished" sign.


It's hard not to be pessimistic.
by Revue Party  (2017-07-16 11:43:06)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

But watching BVG insist on running an NFL defense with a JV unit in 2014 (after the 42 injuries) said a lot about his decision making. And last year was just a fucking catastrophe. A fundamentally sound defense could have gotten last year's team to 8-4, which would still be bad but not laughing-stock bad.

Agree on the Mission Accomplished sign.


let me stress this as strongly as I can:
by jt  (2017-07-16 13:54:02)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

BVG was most certainly NOT running an NFL defense.

He was taking one package of an NFL defense (nickel and dime in passing situations) and trying to install that as his base scheme. It is easy to exploit and it was foolish to run it.

The problem in 2014 is that there was no "base" scheme to return to; since it is all based on packages and reacting to the offense, when you have younger kids in the game that aren't as quick in recognition they are going to struggle getting lined up. Getting lined up on defense should be the easiest thing to do--identify the strength and the formation and go to where you need to be. Should be almost instant recognition. That it was taking so long and guys were so out of position is damning. The fact that the defensive coaches were retained for 2 more years is an indictment of the decision makers, specifically the head coach and the athletic director.


Thanks for the clear and concise explanation. *
by ND_Navy  (2017-07-16 19:09:52)     Delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post


Is that why Joe Schmidt played so mu h?
by Camarillo Brillo  (2017-07-16 18:20:55)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

Because he was one of the few who understood the defense?


I assume so, yes. He got guys lined up
by jt  (2017-07-16 20:23:45)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

it is a hard defense to work in the NFL for the same reason; you've seen guys on the Jets and Ravens that were past their prime but played because Rex Ryan needed someone to get guys in the right spot.

It is a nickel scheme that you can run more frequently in the NFL because there is so much more passing and you're in nickel more. In college, even when you're in nickel it is often a running situation and even having guys slightly out of position is disastrous.


who was the S for the NYJ
by cujaysfan  (2017-07-16 21:10:53)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

same story - played on one leg - but could get guys lined up right

same system - same BVG

jim leonard maybe?


you might be on to something there *
by jt  (2017-07-16 21:23:19)     Delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post


I defer to your expertise.
by Revue Party  (2017-07-16 14:55:21)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

Your third paragraph explains better than what this layman was trying to say. The younger players looked lost en masse in late 2014 and while some of the losses should have been expected given the exodus due to injury, the free will with which some teams seemed to score should not.


I will also mention
by jt  (2017-07-16 16:00:38)     Delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

that such issues had little to nothing to do with strength and conditioning or the type of lifts the kids were doing. That was a completely separate issue.

In other words the program was completely broken and instead of replacing the guy responsible for the program they just tried to plug holes in the dam. That might work for a time but at the end of the day the guy has proven himself unable to do the job at even the most basic of levels; I don't care if you spend 99% of your time on one side of the ball, the basic fundamental weaknesses on defense are simple for even the worst coach to identify. The fact that he didn't identify the issues and is now laying blame at guys that are gone is damning.


Defensive talent on hand is mediocre at best .... *
by Wolfetone  (2017-07-16 10:04:29)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post


It was better than most of our opponents' offenses.
by Revue Party  (2017-07-16 11:46:40)     Delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

10-2 or 9-3 would be a talent issue. 4-8 is an indictment.


coaching was worse than mediocre
by jt  (2017-07-16 11:07:04)     Delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

and it's something that was obvious for everyone to see in 2014. No excuse for having that poor of a defensive staff for 3 years.

Awful job by the head coach. Truly a fireable offense.


I agree
by JBrock18  (2017-07-16 09:47:05)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

Less exotic stuff and more fundamentals. Hold your gap, shed blocks, run to the football, and arrive pissed off. I also like how he said they are going to ask people to do the things they do well and not try to ask someone like Tranquill to do things he isn't suited for. Hopefully he plays mostly at the LOS and isn't asked to cover people in space much anymore. At least Elko appears to talk a good game so far..


I think he and Lea are both good coaches.
by Bruno95  (2017-07-16 10:01:13)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

I also think the immense recruiting holes throughout the defense, the product of years of negligence, has given them tough jobs. My guess is they will join the list of former ND assistants who find success in later stops.


the simplification of scheme and emphasis on fundamentals
by jt  (2017-07-16 11:08:09)     Delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

will pay dividends.

Relatively easy to see a quick turnaround in this unit. The poor fundamentals and play calling on offense likely to stick around as long as Kelly is coaching.


Not sure about immense holes, at least immediately,
by SEE  (2017-07-16 10:49:38)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

We have 4 stars at every position but DT and SS (and I suspect Jay Hayes may slide over) and two 4/5 guys in D. Hayes and N. Morgan. I think our defensive woes were more tied to S&C and BVG than talent. Loved watching our best pass rushers drop into coverage. Just firing BVG improved the defense.

The big concern is that our LB and CB recruiting right now is awful. Lyght signed a good class two years ago, but we are striking out everywhere right now.




Maybe minor holes compared to 8-5 Kelly.
by tdiddy07  (2017-07-16 11:12:32)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

But immense holes compared to a playoff caliber defense.


We have enough talent to be a top 25 defense. I doubt
by SEE  (2017-07-16 11:23:13)     Delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

25 teams have recruited better. The offense will have to be a top 10 offense to reach the playoffs. 10-2 should be Kelly's bar. Overall recruiting has averaged in the top 10.

The coaching has not.


I'll say this. A lot of people talked about the 30 for 30,
by rkg  (2017-07-15 23:03:04)     Delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

in that era, when an ND defensive football player hit you, you could hear it (to paraphrase Rock himself.)

On top of that, if an Irish defender could touch you, he would tackle you. Guys like George Streeter Todd Lyght Stonebraker, Stams, Pritchett, Zorich. Sure tacklers, every darn one of them.

On top of that, A LOT OF FOOTBALL is knocking your opponent backwards. That is do they fall forward or backwards? Are they pushing you around or are they the shopping cart?

If ND can tackle, block well and pick up short yard situations, and get off the field on third down, I'll be slightly encouraged. But right now, it's all talk.


"NOTRE DAME, Indiana - Mike Elko, widely considered one of
by cj  (2017-07-15 21:58:17)     Delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

college football's brightest defensive minds, (Where?) has been named defensive coordinator for the University of Notre Dame.

Elko is one of only two defensive coordinators in the nation to have a unit rank in the top-40 (not true) of the Football Bowl Subdivision in total defense over the last five years (2014-16 at Wake Forest and 2012-13 at Bowling Green)."

Wake Forest Total D

2014 41
2015 38
2016 40

I wonder where our crack team gets its’ #’s.

AAhh, 41 that’s close enough…

http://www.cfbstats.com/2014/leader/national/team/defense/split01/category10/sort01.html



None of this matters..
by Cliff Claven  (2017-07-15 21:01:45)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

Kelly's play calling and decision making will continue to put his defense in bad spots. Here is all you need to know, we played a game in hurricane conditions our dumb-fuck HC wins the coin toss and takes the ball. He puts his offense on the field in driving rain and going into 45 mph winds. We go 3 and out on 3 incomplete passes and we have to punt into the wind.
Cliffy


I had tried to block that from my mind
by Ty Webb  (2017-07-19 10:03:39)     Delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

But the stupidity shown by Kelly from the very start of that game until the very end should have been enough to get him fired.


My understanding is that Kelly will not call plays. *
by NDTwice  (2017-07-16 04:46:08)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post


Pretty damning that we would rather have a second year oc
by Sb  (2017-07-16 18:08:27)     Delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post

Call plays, than our 30 year head coach.


How many times have we heard that across the years? *
by Saxattack29  (2017-07-16 14:18:58)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post


This time Kelly really means it. *
by BottleofRed  (2017-07-16 14:49:59)     cannot delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post


REALLY means it this time *
by Ty Webb  (2017-07-19 10:00:53)     Delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post


This post frustrates Ned Beatty.
by 105Marquette  (2017-07-16 14:01:29)     Delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post


Good lord. *
by MD1997  (2017-07-16 11:23:21)     Delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post


Do you really believe that? *
by Cliff Claven  (2017-07-16 09:45:30)     Delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post


You don't seriously believe that,do you? *
by Wolfetone  (2017-07-16 07:41:54)     Delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post


That's pretty damning evidence. *
by trout  (2017-07-15 21:26:08)     Delete  |  Edit  |  Return to Board  |  Ignore Poster   |   Highlight Poster  |   Reply to Post


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